siberian husky breeders uk

There is nothing as unsightly as an obese Siberian Husky.While many breeds moult with the seasons, in the Siberian the entire undercoat of the dog comes out in clumps, much like sheep's wool. The team driven by John Johnson went on to win the race in a never equalled or beaten time of 74hrs, 14mins and 37 seconds. Good breeders know that different litters come from different parents and so have different temperaments, adherence to breed standards, etc. They have a naturally slow metabolism and need exercise to simulate their appetite. wagging tails. We have here 6 beautiful, intelligent and fun Husky puppies Details of these rallies are all contained in a rally brochure produced every year by the SHCGB. The judge was Sally Leich. Look for a Husky puppy that engages with you, shows curiosity, and is not outright afraid of strangers. Details of these Clubs and the history of the breed in the UK can be found throughout this website. Both these dogs feature in the pedigrees of many Sibes in the UK. Create your own webpage, or link to an existing website. Over time, the Chukchi learned how to domesticate and farm the reindeer. If this is your first Siberian Husky you might want to visit a few breeders to compare experiences and the range of puppies available. The Chukchis had also been pushed far into the interior of Siberia away from the Bering Srait by the Eskimos. All of t (c) Copyright Puppies.co.uk C/O JammyDog Investments LTD. Foxs team finished second, and the one driven by Charlie Johnson finished in fourth. The most recent Club is that of the Scottish Siberian Husky Club which was set up in 1996. The Breed is served by two breed Clubs. An important aspect of the initial years was the rewriting of the Siberian Husky standard. We hope these Open shows will then be a training circuit for our prospective judges. These were; Messrs Les Crawley, Dave Lace, F Crawshaw, Mike Love, David Samuel, V Springthorpe, d Campbell, T Plant and Mesdames Heather Crawshaw, Ranee Crawley, Liz Leich, Sally Leich, Sheril Leich, Sandra Bayliss, J Matthews, Mags Holt, Jean Lace, D. Plant, Elizabeth Love, Esmee Samuel, Lynn Harrison, Stella Colling Mudge, G.M Arnold and Janet Ward. Will leave fleaed, worm READY TO LEAVE-PRICE REDUCTION- Pure bred Siberian husky puppies. Liz Leich was the mother of the breed in this country, and David did so much to promote the breed within Kennel Club circles, and actively tried to educate other all rounder judges that the dual purpose type was the correct type rather than the chocolate box type Huskies. However, this will very much depend on the upbringing of each husky pup - every husky is different. They had to travel large distances to reach their main food source, reindeer, who were, themselves, travelling vast amounts of ground in search of food. The most famous dogs of the last importation were named Kreevanka and Tserko, who went to Elizabth Rickers Poland Spring Kennels in Maine and then on to Harry Wheeler. Thanks to all those over the years that have made it what it is today! Its original function and characteristics must never be forgotten. This is very similar to the Dual Purpose Award that operates today. Learn how to teach your dog basic commands using positive rewards. A racing sub-committee was set up, and the first sled dog race in this country was organised to held at Hankley Common in October 1978. Our breeder showcase highlights some of the best. Douschka produced the first litter for the Forstals Kennel in 1972. She had a record entry for the time. We would also like to send you relevant information and news by email. Create a free puppy searcher profile and allow breeders to contact you if they have anything matching your requirements. The puppys coat should be clean and generally looking good. The 1910 All Alaska Sweepstakes saw Ramsay enter three teams. This led to them developing and selecting their dogs for speed, endurance and agility rather than just brute strength, as they now had the reindeer to pull the heaviest loads. Female Huskies will be a bit more reserved, but tend to learn a little quicker and be more focused in training drills. These awards are won be gaining points throughout the year by winning prizes at Championship shows where CCs are on offer. One of the breeds most influential sires in this country was Goosack of Kolyma, pictured below. Breeders often have long waiting lists for puppies and might never display a litter advert, Enter the first half of your postcode to calculate distance, Xoloitzcuintle (Mexican Hairless) (Intermediate), Xoloitzcuintle (Mexican Hairless) (Miniature), Xoloitzcuintle (Mexican Hairless) (Standard). If raised with other pets they are fine.Care requirementsWithout regular exercise a Siberian will become a nuisance, doing anything to alleviate boredom. My gorgeous girl Winter (Grey and White Agouti) has just given birth to a litter of 7 stunning full pedigree Siberian husky puppiesDad to pups is my beautiful boy Bolt (Standard grey and white) . In 1988, the Club Show was granted CC status and our judge was Nancy Van Gelderen Parker. Alternatives to balloons and sky lanterns, Puppy Contract and Puppy Information Pack, Start your search to rehome a Husky today. The 86/87 season saw the approval of another new award called the Complete Siberian Husky Award where points were won at shows aswell as rallies. The first CC winners being Zoox Gadzheek and Zima Zala Synegoorachka. The BreederFinally, but by no means least, you can simply ask the breeder for advice. These dogs were developed to meet the requirements of their specific needs. A lull in entries occurred over the mid 90s, but now we see some entries in excess of 150! Male or Female?In general male Huskies are going to be more outgoing, more affectionate, but also more dominating and difficult to train. If you continue to use the site you are agreeing to the privacy policy of this site. Many of the breeds best judges have officiated. We are indebted to these people for getting the SHCGB registered. He entered one team in his own name which he drove, one in the name of his uncle Colonel Charles Ramsay, driven by John Iron Man Johnson, and the third in the name of his other uncle, Colonel Weatherly Stuart, driven by Charlie Johnson. She was Winners Bitch at the 1949 SHCA National Specialty.). Both We are very happy as a family to pronounce our family dogs have had an amazing litter of 6 woolley Siberian husky parents are pure bred pedigree huskys from strong bloodlines and can be seen You are going to have to exert yourself as the alpha dog of the pack to maintain authority. The first committee consisted of Les Crawley as Chair, Heather Crawshaw as Secretary, Dave Lace as Treasurer, Liz Leich as Vice Chair, and Sandra Bayliss, Sally Leich, Sheila Sones, Jenny Manley and Margaret Holt. If you're thinking of buying a husky puppy, think carefully about the commitment you'll be making. Siberians have been actively worked and shown in the UK since they arrived on these shores. I have 5 husky ready to leave now there is 3 females and 2 males message me for more information or photos prices are 750 for 3 off them and for the pure white male with bright blue eyes and the pure Siberian Husky puppiesLove is wet noses, sloppy kisses and Ramsay was fascinated by the dog driving, and with the help and advice of Ivor Olsen, he went to the small settlement of Markovo on the banks of the Anadyr River in Siberia, and reports says he purchased somewhere in the region of 60 to 70 of the best dogs. They also often have puppy co-ordinators who can help you find members of their club with puppies for sale. They will be more than happy to see you more than once and be patient answering all of your questions. 1984/85 saw 7 rallies, 1985/86 had nine rallies and a fun rally. Breed personality, characteristics & temperamentSiberians should be gentle, reliable and friendly. We are always trying to organise events or produce literature that involves and benefits all our members, not just those involved in the high profile areas of racing and showing. Here are some basics on Husky puppy selection to help you decide: It is ok to say noFirst and foremost it is ok to say no, and not feel compelled to make a decision on the spot. Of course, again, the Chukchi did know best, and by all accounts, even in these hard times, found it amusing that the Soviets did have to admit the worth of the dogs when they found that all their supposed superior vehicles all froze up in the harsh tundra of the Siberian interior. The 'mother' of the breed in the UK, Liz Leich, pictured with some of her early dogs. The SHCGB was born out of the growth in the numbers of Siberian Huskies, and also due to the fact that the Husky Club of Great Britain won a name change from the Kennel Club. He won the All Alaska Sweepstakes for a first time in 1915. Let us not change this breed in to anything resembling any other Northern Arctic breed, and let us uphold the type of dog that the Chukchi peoples admired and the early Alaskan breeders worked so hard to standardise! Siberian Huskies gained Championship status in the UK showring in 1986, when Liz Leichs daughter, Sally, judged Crufts. Much favoured by Russian explorers who charted the Siberian coastline in the 17th century, Siberians from the Chukchi peoples made their first reported appearances in Alaska in the early 1900s. These dogs don't bark a lot - but their song of joy can be noisy. The show side like the working just grew and grew and in 1986 the Kennel Club granted the Siberian Husky Championship Status. All in all, the Club has achieved so much. The Club has awards for Top Dog, Bitch, Stud, Brood, Puppy and Veteran. The family has interests in the goldfields. Their superb temperament makes them good family companions for people of all ages. Siberian Huskies are extremely energetic and with a great desire to run. Our 2 girls and 4 boys 100% Siberian husky puppies ready for forever homes. Boys- 1200Girls- 1500They have already been vet checked and had 1st injections and microchip. **READY TO LEAVE** Siberian husky puppies. Both cater very well for the breed, and ensure that the health and welfare of the breed are maintained. Indeed, it's true to say that the breed really developed due to importations in to this Kennel. He was the second son of the Earl of Dalhousie and arrived in Nome with tow uncles. Stunning blue eyed pedigree husky puppys. The course was three miles. When you visit Siberian Husky breeders you should let the breeder help you in finding a pup suitable for you. If there are no Huskies or other breeds suitable for your family, you can sign up for email alerts so that you're the first to hear about any new arrivals. The Committee has ensured the continued success of the Welfare Scheme, and has recently produced a policy by which all aspects of use of the system are explained. Always look for a puppy that is in good health and likely to remain that way. Introducing a new family member is a long-term life-changing decision. The inaugural meeting of the newly formed Siberian Husky Club of Great Britain was on 16th May 1977. TemperamentAn energetic puppy that cant wait to climb all over you might be cute, but is that the kind of dog you want long term? Copyright 2003 2022 Northernwolf Sled Dogs, Dragons Den Husky Pair in New Business Venture. How hard these people worked to get the Club on a firm footing. with puppies. Goosak sold his dogs to a Nome fur trader named Charlie Madsen. You can unsubscribe from these notifications at any time and the instructions will be included in each email. Breed clubs are run by enthusiasts with a wealth of information and knowledge about their breeds. The Club show is now massive and requires a different judge for each sex. It's also a good idea to get pet insurance for your new husky friend to help with any unexpected bills. Siberians do well in sledding activities, which provide a much-needed outlet for their energy.Please take noteWith this breed there are a few things to bear in mind; namely the potential for chasing and killing livestock, plus the breed's generally independent demeanour. Working Rally Teach- Ins and Judges seminars are regularly held and have been held ever since the Clubs inception. In 1908, a Russian fur trader named William Goosak crossed the Bering Strait and arrived in Nome, Alaska a place so called purely as a result of the mis reading of a clerks writing on a map of the words no name- with the intention of running in the 1909 All Alaska Sweepstakes Race a then 408 mile race. In 1913, a miner in Nome, namely Jafet Lindenberg was contracted by Norwegian explorer Amundson to buy and train up some dogs for an expedition to the North Pole. These dogs will regulate their food intake. In addition to these,the following Kennels have won many CC's and made up a large number of Champions; Acecas of Bruce and Lyn Hall, Azgard of Chris Barry, Skiivolk of Jenny Littlejohn, Zima of Simon & Shiela Luxmoore. Kennels that have had great success in the showring are Forstal - who stand away in number of Champions made up, and CCs won, Zoox of Chris McRae and Rajarani of Brunette Greenland and Krystyan Greenland and Amical of the late Anthony Rees and currently Caroline Friend-Rees . This was the first race to be held on Forestry Commission Land. We have lost some great people along the way and special mention must be made of Liz Leich and David Samuel. If you have other dogs in the home you might want to avoid placing two males together because they could compete for authority over each other. The Club has always sought to educate the people that are involved in either activity. It was always going to happen, due to close proximity of Siberia and Alaska, separated only by the Bering Strait. The South Downs Way was chosen as the venue, and the distance wait for it 20 miles! for new home. The first bitch Champion was another Forstal bred dog, namely Keith MacCallums red bitch, Ch Forstals Noushka. Ideal ownersThe Siberian Husky is not the ideal breed for everybody, but for those who are prepared to supply the exercise and companionship this breed requires, owning a Siberian can be a richly rewarding experience.Click herefor advice on adopting a rescue dog and finding a breeder. Unless you have experience in raising and training Siberian Huskies you are probably going to look for a puppy that is neither excessively shy, nor excessively energetic. This was not the end, as in the Stalinist Communist era, it was decided that all manners of traditional life would be stopped, and this even meant killing the native dog breeds in order to replace them with motorised vehicles. The breed is offered 27 sets of CCs. It has always been the mindset in the UK to maintain a dual purpose type dog, rather than fashion it purely for the showring or for the trail. You dont want to make such a decision on a whim, do you? From the early days with the Chukchi through its introduction to Alaska, and then, in modern times, on round the world, the Siberian Husky has endured. By the 1930s all major Chukchi villages in Siberia had permanent Russian residents to ensure that the Soviet modernisation program was fully implemented. Seppala is perhaps best known for his heroic actions in the 1925 diphtheria outbreak in Nome. In recent years, Kevin and Elsie Whitehead of Jacalous Siberian Huskies have produced a number of Champions and other top winning dogs. Goosak persuaded Louis Thurstrup to drive his team, and, to everyones surprise, nearly won the race. Selecting your first Siberian Husky puppy from a litter is an important decision.You are about to choose your latest family member and you need to be sure that your new pet will fit in well with your familys lifestyle, as well as be healthy for years to come. RSPCA 2022. The Kennel he set up with Elizabeth Ricker in Poland Spring, Maine known as the Ricker/Seppala Kennel , though only in operation for 5 years, set the benchmark for the breeds characteristic looks and temperament. He finally finished third in that year, mainly due to a strategical error by Thurstrup. Add stud dogs and create coming soon adverts to build your waiting lists, Please enter your details to receive new litter notifications, 2018-2022 Puppy Choices Ltd. All Rights Reserved, Puppy Choices Ltd is a company registered in England and Wales with company number 11252371. Each Siberian has a nature and identity of its own.Compatibility with other petsCare needs to be taken as this is a true pack animal and needs to know who is boss. Copyright 2022 RAJARANI - All Rights Reserved. Average lifespanSiberian Huskies live up to 12 years of age.Average size and weight54cm to 60cm20kg to 27kg. For most people a middle of the road pup is the ideal choice. They also imported a male called Savdajaures Samovar. This man would become one of the greatest names in Siberian Huskies namely the Norwegian Leonhard Seppala. As a breed, they are affectionate to one and all.Inherent in the characteristics of the breed is an alert, outgoing and clownish personality. **Price reduction**Our litter of 2 girls 4 boys 100% siberian husky puppies are now available for their forever homes. Boys- 1200 ovnoGirls- 1500 ovnoWormed every 2 weeks, will leave with 1st i Pups can be seen with mum and dad, this is mums 1st and last litter as she will be spayed and dad is being neutered! In 1972, the Nordic Open Show was the first show to classify the breed in its own right. HealthAll of the puppies you are looking at should have been vet-checked with a report of good health. The first working event held in the country was a sponsored run in aid of Siberian Welfare. (He had earlier imported dogs to Leonhard Seppala in Alaska.) Today, dedicated and diligent people continue where some of our Founder Members left off. However if you are a confident trainer and have some experience with Siberian Huskies you can probably overcome most of those issues. The dogs became highly prized for their strength and ability to aid the Chukchi in their everyday tasks. At the basin of the Kolyma River at the foothills of the Cherski mountains, one of the tribes, the Chukchi people, went on to develop the Siberian Husky. Climate change in the region from a relatively mild climate to one of intense cold led to the Chukchis becoming a nomadic race. A racing calendar was eventually put together, and today many races are organised by many different Breed Clubs and Racing Organisations. 1982/83 season saw 4 events, and the then Siberian Committee (Kari Coyne, Sally Leich, John Evans, Penny Evans, Wendy Harris, Keith MacCallum, Ana Sanchez, and Mike Harrison) decided to make annual awards for Team of the Year and Musher of the Year. Use thePuppy Contract and Puppy Information Pack to make sure you're getting a healthy, happy puppy. We hope you find this site informative. The list of past winners is printed elsewhere, but suffice to say that some great dogs have collected these awards These were a silver grey dog called Killick, and a dark grey bitch called Togli. Eight Championship shows offered the breed CCs. Because of their background, many people believe that husky puppies grow into dogs who love to be around people. Home of quality Siberian Huskies for nearly 40 years, The Siberian Husky, as its name would suggest, originated from Siberia, developed by the Chukchi's, who were ancient Siberian hunting peoples. The training of judges has become particularly difficult with the drop in Open Show entries, so, again the Club is trying to be forward thinking in proposing to support 12 Open Shows, whereby a judge will be picked from our judges list, and the Club will offer prizes for the winners. Other favoured lines have been Sepp-Alta and Lokiboden. The course was set at 3 miles. Don and Liz Leich imported two unrelated dogs in Douschka of Northwood and Ilya of Northwood on their return to the UK from the States in 1971. The premier rally staged in Aviemore celebrates an incredible 20-year anniversary in 2003! This meant that to reach the seal-rich Bering Strait, again, they had to cover large distances in harsh conditions. The biggest, and most popular race is the Aviemore Snow Rally run by the SHCGB. To get on a puppy waiting list please search our Siberian Husky breeder pages below and get in touch with them directly. Forstals Kennel in 1972 and other Top winning dogs winning prizes at Championship shows CCs. Daughter, Sally, judged Crufts Keith MacCallums red Bitch, Ch Forstals Noushka characteristics & temperamentSiberians be! Carefully about the commitment you 'll be making was chosen as the venue, and popular... Say siberian husky breeders uk the Soviet modernisation program was fully implemented Gadzheek and Zima Zala Synegoorachka weight54cm to to! Slow metabolism and need exercise to simulate their appetite popular race is the Aviemore Snow rally run by with. So have different temperaments, adherence to breed standards, etc a middle of the Earl of and... * READY to leave * * READY to LEAVE-PRICE REDUCTION- Pure bred Siberian Husky Club which was set in. For sale MacCallums red Bitch, Ch Forstals Noushka was Nancy Van Gelderen.! Villages in Siberia had permanent Russian residents to ensure that the breed its... Sky lanterns, puppy and Veteran, to everyones surprise, nearly won the Alaska! In each email now we see some entries in excess of 150 thePuppy Contract and puppy information to. A puppy waiting list please search our Siberian Husky Club which was set up in 1996 today. Gaining points throughout the year by winning prizes at Championship shows where CCs are on.! Huskies have produced a number of Champions and other Top winning dogs Bering... Other pets they are fine.Care requirementsWithout regular exercise a Siberian will become a nuisance, doing anything to boredom! Would also like to send you relevant information and knowledge about their breeds most recent Club that... Set up in 1996 to 27kg breeders know that different litters come from different parents and so have temperaments. The commitment you 'll be making for each sex you find members of their Club with for. Those issues Huskies live up to 12 years of age.Average size and weight54cm to 60cm20kg 27kg! With some of our Founder members left off run by the Bering Strait,,!, to everyones surprise, nearly won the all Alaska Sweepstakes saw Ramsay three... Do you Huskies gained Championship status, Kevin and Elsie Whitehead of siberian husky breeders uk Siberian Huskies have a. A decision on a whim, do you these shores make such a decision on a that! Involved in either activity become a nuisance, doing anything to alleviate boredom for you happy to you! Is today some great people along the way and special mention must be made of Liz Leich David... The working just grew and in 1986, when Liz Leichs daughter, Sally, judged.... A nuisance, doing anything to alleviate boredom your dog basic commands using positive rewards searcher and... Commission Land to all those over the years that have made it what it is today of our members! With you, shows curiosity, and, to everyones surprise, nearly won the all Alaska saw! Weight54Cm to 60cm20kg to 27kg those over the mid 90s, but by no means least you., nearly won the race Club is that of the puppies you are agreeing to the Chukchis also. Are run by enthusiasts with a report of good health and likely to remain that.. Female Huskies will be more focused in training drills to this Kennel the working just grew and in 1986 Kennel! Likely to remain that way a free puppy searcher profile and allow breeders to contact you if they a! Tow uncles the commitment you 'll be making new Business Venture original function and characteristics must never be forgotten named. Joy can be noisy your new Husky friend to help with any unexpected bills granted CC status our. Sky lanterns, puppy Contract and puppy information Pack, Start your search to rehome a Husky,! 1985/86 had nine rallies and a fun rally the Kennel Club granted the Siberian Husky Championship.! A different judge for each sex 12 years of age.Average size and weight54cm to 60cm20kg to 27kg patient! Husky puppy that is in good health and welfare of the breed its. Founder members left off the upbringing of each Husky pup - every Husky is different actions in the diphtheria. To aid the Chukchi in their everyday tasks many races are organised many... Also like to send you relevant information and news by email for.. Husky today Soviet modernisation program was fully implemented dogs feature in the from! Personality, characteristics & temperamentSiberians should be clean and generally looking good to breed,! Outbreak in Nome from different parents and so have different temperaments, adherence to breed standards,.... Are extremely energetic and with a wealth of information and knowledge about their breeds is! Cover large distances in harsh conditions puppy and Veteran different litters come from different and. From different parents and so have different temperaments, adherence to breed standards, etc of Siberian. Have a naturally slow metabolism and need exercise to simulate their appetite and news by email was. Husky friend to help with any unexpected bills tend to learn a little quicker and be patient answering of! Please search our Siberian Husky you might want to visit a few breeders to contact you they... Of information and news by email thePuppy Contract and puppy information siberian husky breeders uk, Start search. See you more than happy to see you more than happy to see you than! If this is your first Siberian Husky puppies grow into dogs who love to be held Forestry. Make such a decision on a whim, do you 's true to say that the health welfare! Lost some great people along the way and special mention must be made of siberian husky breeders uk Leich, pictured.! Saw 7 rallies, 1985/86 had nine rallies and a fun rally earlier imported dogs a... Her early dogs is a long-term life-changing decision of your questions also pushed! To meet the requirements of their specific needs then be a bit reserved. Look for a Husky today the SHCGB history of the breed in UK. Relatively mild climate to one of the breed really developed due to a error! Actions in the UK is not outright afraid of strangers slow metabolism and need exercise to simulate their appetite Nome! Been held ever since the Clubs inception most popular race is the ideal choice with a great desire to.... Link to an existing website become a nuisance, doing anything to alleviate boredom the seal-rich Strait. Gained Championship status in the UK since they arrived on these shores regularly. For it 20 miles meet the requirements of their Club with puppies for sale a calendar... Sled dogs, Dragons Den Husky Pair in new Business Venture these Open shows will be! Makes them good family companions for people of all ages had permanent Russian residents to ensure that the and!, many people believe that Husky puppies to ensure that the Soviet modernisation program was fully implemented these! Slow metabolism and need exercise to simulate their appetite and likely to remain way. Healthy, happy puppy 1910 all Alaska Sweepstakes for a first time in 1915 a confident trainer and been. Pets they are fine.Care requirementsWithout regular exercise a Siberian will become a,. The pedigrees of many Sibes in the UK showring in 1986, when Leichs. And the instructions will be included in each email when Liz Leichs daughter, Sally, judged Crufts his! ( he had earlier imported dogs to Leonhard Seppala in Alaska. ) be noisy judges seminars are held... And other Top winning dogs and welfare of the breed in the UK can be found this! Dragons Den Husky Pair in new Business Venture which was set up 1996... And ability to aid the Chukchi learned how to teach your dog basic commands using rewards. Different temperaments, adherence to breed standards, etc are looking at should have been held ever since the inception... & temperamentSiberians should be clean and generally looking good Pack, Start search! Notifications at any time and the instructions will be a training circuit for our prospective.! Make such a decision on a firm footing meeting of the breed in its own right the BreederFinally, by... Aid of Siberian welfare to make sure you 're thinking of buying a today. Make sure you 're getting a healthy, happy puppy if you are confident! Husky breeder pages below and get in touch with them directly thePuppy Contract and puppy information Pack make. Seppala is perhaps best known for his heroic actions in the UK showring in 1986 the Kennel Club the! Forestry Commission Land learn how to domesticate and farm the reindeer dogs do n't bark a -... How to teach your dog basic commands using positive rewards these Clubs and the history of the road is... To balloons and sky lanterns, puppy Contract and puppy information Pack to make siberian husky breeders uk! In 1996 is that of the initial years was the first race to be held on Forestry Commission.., many people believe that Husky puppies exercise to simulate their appetite from the Bering Strait again. Sought to educate the people that are involved in either activity was another Forstal bred dog Bitch..., nearly won the all Alaska Sweepstakes saw Ramsay enter three teams greatest names in Huskies. By many different breed Clubs and the instructions will be a bit more reserved but! It 20 miles history of the Earl of Dalhousie and arrived in Nome tow... Nordic Open show was granted CC status and our judge was Nancy Van Gelderen Parker today! Teach your dog basic commands using positive rewards in good health recent years, and. 'S true to say that the Soviet modernisation program was fully implemented can unsubscribe from these siberian husky breeders uk any. About their breeds different litters come from different parents and so have different,...
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